Device Details

Device Overview

Name/Version: outist - insist 1.5
Author: Crampe  
Description: outist is a free device that lets you route any signal to any internal or external destination.
It’s designed to bypass Live’s restricted return buss routing. With outist you can have pre and post send PER return channel.
You can also simply use it to send the signal to any physical output or just anywhere in your set…

Insist (you guessed...) is now part of the download.

L10 and Max8 required

- fixed the delay setting timing. There was 1 sample of delay when the delay was set to 0ms

- added Insist
- added an option to delay the Send signal.
- the dry signal (i.e the source) can now be muted.
- minor UI tweaks

- fix track chooser issue, finally!
- added Push mapping

-fix unwanted events being sent to Live's undo history

-fixed output volume; previously the output wasn't totally muted when at -inf
- fixed invisible big knob

Device Details

Tags effect, utility, other
Live Version Used: 10.0.1
Max Version Used: 8
Date Added: Mar 27 2018 15:34:21
Date Last Updated: May 23 2021 16:48:39
Device Type: audio_device
Download URL (report link)
License (more info): None


just what i needed, thank you

trying to download the update but gumroad has crapped the bed. will try later. thanks for a really useful device.

Sorry, but i can,t get this working.All i have is the name of your sends.A room, B-Spring,C plate etc... but my actual channels and returns doesn,t appear so i can,t send the audio anywhere.I try with every update until 1.2 and nothings works.I have a screen capture but i can,t upload here.

Not working

v1 working (I've tested some sidechain stuff), the new v1.2 is a total mess and doesn't work here.

Hi dudes,
Sorry, it looks like there's an issue with the last update.
I'm just coming back home; fixing this asap.
Sorry for the hassle.

To those who don't have the right track names appearing in the drop-down menu: are you using L9 by any chance?
This device needs Live 10.

i have installed both,but using live 10 with this device.I,m on mac, don,t know if this is important.

the first version worked fine for me on win7 live 10 but after downloading the 1.2 update i get the wrong track names,

I'll donate $20 if I can get it to work. Currently(1.2) doesn't pass audio to my return tracks, the names aren't correct, and the field under the destination is blank.

I've tried to download it again, at first it worked but then, on the second try, it's bugged again with all the strange track names and the mess.
v1 works fine as usual.

same problem here. i love the device but it seems like live10 messed it up. would love it to work properly since its a great tool.

Track chooser issue is solved.

Has anyone tried modding this to be a wet/dry (target track/current track) output?

just great. thank you very much

I really like this device quite a lot. I was curious how difficult it would be to make a version that takes an input from anywhere instead. I attempted to change the arguments to audio_input 2, but the list it pulled up of inputs doesn't match the set, so I'm a bit confused as how to proceed further.

I was hoping to use this as a way to route 3 different audio channels into a single effect but be able to choose which audio source will come through to the effect.

Thanks for your efforts and let me know if it's something super easy to change.

Hey Crampe, great device! I have a question though. Is it possible to create a similar plugin that could divide a signal EQUALLY between two destinations? E.G. the more I send to a location, the less remains on the main channel? This would be fantastic for sidechaining! Thanks a lot, let me know!

@ mcnaggers
Do you mean a dry/wet ?

v1.3 works like a charm!!

Works very well! Thanks.

I was wandering if it would be possible to create some routing where you can feed the output of an Effect Rack back into the same Effect. Really an Input device that you can target by the outitst. Thx.

Hi Crampe, I've tried to find your mail but failed, so I contact u through M4L. I'm looking for a double Outist with a switch A/B in order to alternate between routings. Here's my mail if u can help my request...

Great job, BiP is amazing too !


@Brianboston, why not simply rack 2 instances of Outist in 2 different chains, and crossfade between them?

@Crampe - Would love to see an Inist device to pull audio FROM anywhere. :D

@Crampe Hey, I absolutely love this plugin and it opens many possibilities, but I was wondering...
When I set track A to route to Track B, and record/print the incoming signal onto track B, there appears to be a delay when I zoom in and compare the peaks between Track A and B. Does this device have inherent latency in the playback or am I doing something wrong?

@Crampe Also, to follow up, is there any quality loss whatsoever when it routes signal to another track?

Thanks again.

Hey JeremySiegel,

Honestly I can't tell you anything specifics about the latency, as it's something totally dependant on Live's API, and M4L isn't absolutely perfect with timing. That's just the way it is implemented and I can't do anything about this.

About quality, it's just the same as routing from a track to another one, it's just a bus. It uses the Live API and not some Max objects to send the signal.
So even though I haven't done a phase canceling test, I'm 100% sure there's absolutely no difference between your orignal source and the resulting routed signal.
So no quality loss whatsoever.

I just did a test and I don't get any latency here.
You probably have a plugin that introduce latency on your source track.
And I also did a phase cancelling test, just for the fun, and obviously it cancels out perfectly. So 100% exact same quality.

had some crashes, wonder if its just me?

Hey Brodiem,
I never got any complains about these devices crashing.
In which situation does it happen?

It was my version of Ableton they stated in some release notes thanks, would it be possible to get a solo on the reciveing end of outist i think the api would be possible

Yeah Brodiem, I could add a solo. That's not really how I envision the device or what I'd use, but I admit this is something that would probably be handy for many people.

Love your plugins!

Seems to be a bug where insist changes it's thru mode to off from time to time. Just reporting :)

Hey LudicrouSpeed,
Thanks for the report. Did you notice any pattern that would trigger this bug?

Fantastic device!

Is there any way to change the curve of Outist's send parameter so that it matches Live's send parameter? When copying automation from Live's send to Outist's send the values do not match up.

Hey Aussir,
that's an interesting point! I'll look into this ;-)

great lil plug-in.

but running into an issue where I get stuck in an infinite undo/redo step loop once I load up Outist in Live. once it's in a rack, Ctrl + Z will simply cycle between two audio outputs and go no further back in the project's undo history.

Hey crampe,

I fucking love this m4l device and it's instrumental to my workflow and I think it's awesome.

You should know that I'm having what I think is the same / similar problem as jabernathie. Any time I add or delete a track in a set that has Outist in it, it floods the Undo history with a loop of "Undo Change" "Undo Change in 'Outist'" messages that go back and forth forever. Despite this, I love Outist so much I just use it anyway, and it's never fucked me over until now.

I love this device so much; Pleeeeease fix this. Outist & Insist were free but I would straight up pay you $20 anyway if you fixed this one thing.

Hey dudes,
thanks for poiting this issue out. I never noticed this myself before, I'm wondering at which point it started happening? I have to look at it, but due to the nature of the device I feel like it's something in M4L that's causing this, maybe a a bug that appeared at some point during a Max update.
Sorry for the hassle, I'm on it asap!

i dont know if this can be fixed but copy and paste it resets the output which is unfortunate. great work btw :)

Hey Teehaa,
I'll check this, thanks!

This is an amazing tool, it has helped me do a ton of tricks using racks and try some summing odd ideas.

does this plugin cause any latency? I am using most of my processing plugins on a send / return basis instead of using them as inserts. Ableton limits the amount of send / return busses and I would love to use just audiotracks instead but obviously timing is crucial.

@Yentz: nope

Regarding latency..... If I send to a physical external output will it have less latency than Live's External Effect device? The Live device reports latency, Outist reports 0ms but the Outist signal seems to have more audible latency than External Audio Effect on playback.


Hey prizzle9,
the time needed for your sound to be converted from digital to analog depends on your computer + sound card. Outist's processing doesn't add latency afaik, but you can't fight against the laws of nature that applies to get the waves out of your speakers. I'm surprised that you're seeing more delay compare to the External Audio Effect, but unfortunately I can't help here.
While it's possible to use Outist to send signals to physical output it was mainly designed to route stuff internally, so if you like External Audio Effect works best in some situations, just go for it ;-)

Hi Crampe, the Insist device is exactly what I need for my reference routing

Thanks for the great device

However, It seems the UNDO History bug is back.

Any chance it will be fixed soon?

I'll check this.
Is it happening all the time or only in certain situations?

Hi Crampe,

I've got an issue with this plugin where it seems to break Abletons undo history. I accidentally deleted a couple of channels in a project and when attempting to undo, Ableton made changes to the instance of Inist in my project instead. Otherwise this is a great device!


Yeah, if I remember well it has to do with the source/destination selector... which is a built-in M4L "object". You should experience the same issue with e.g Ableton's Surround Panner device.

link isnt working?

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